Claudia Schaler

Claudia Schaler

  • Marnie, what do you think of al-anon?

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 5 days, 4 hours ago

    👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻🙂

  • Topic today ? I’m planning to call in, so if I don’t arrive it is technical 🙂

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 5 days, 5 hours ago

    Have you read Barbara Allen and Jesse Scholl?

    I don’t imagine researchers are oblivious to what they cannot study, only emphasizing that this lacunae is significant issue for many COH whom I talk to… it is a major road block for many who feel that experts “don’t get it.” Many have disengaged… but the landscape is very different from what wa…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 5 days, 16 hours ago

    I get what you are saying about PD. The problem is basically that 100% of our parents never seek treatment for hoarding disorder so these two populations do not overlap. We don’t know the population in treatment and experts don’t know ours… I don’t know anyone from COH Yahoo whose parent was ever treated and Many seem to feel their paren…[Read more]

    • This was a lot to take in so I hope that I have addressed each issue for you here.

      The ‘fortress effect’ is definitely a common thread in hoarding. Remember that the clutter is a symptom of hoarding disorder, it is a ‘soothing behavior’ for lack of a better description. This explains why there are physical walls built to reflect the internal…[Read more]

      • Have you read Barbara Allen and Jesse Scholl?

        I don’t imagine researchers are oblivious to what they cannot study, only emphasizing that this lacunae is significant issue for many COH whom I talk to… it is a major road block for many who feel that experts “don’t get it.” Many have disengaged… but the landscape is very different from what wa…[Read more]

      • I would agree that the landscape is significantly different now. Additionally, more and more COH and spouses are getting out in the public arena to speak about their experience and the impact on their lives as well as partnering with researchers. These include, but are not limited to, the authors you mentioned, Cecelia Garrett – who has partnered…[Read more]

      • 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻🙂

      • Group in 30 minutes, will you be participating? Amelia is likely unable to, she’s out of town doing some self-care.

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 5 days, 16 hours ago

    I also see the fortress-effect of the hoard functioning as a huge LEAVE ME ALONE, KEEP OUT OR ELSE, just like substance abuse, and the fortress keeps people/experience from causing pain, it has a distancing, numbing , anesthetic effect. Given the rampant alcoholism in my mother’s family, and her vehement determination that she would never be a…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 5 days, 23 hours ago

    This interface is killing me Marnie… I just typed a really long reply and it vanished. i’m Going to send you and email instead

  • is there a topic for this week? 2:30?

  • When does this happen?

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 6 days, 7 hours ago

    YES. I wish I could unpack it better, but I assume you already picked up on that Marnie. I’m finally resettled for this Thursday :). So many coh I talk to seem to be responding to what look like NPD, BPD, histrionic, paranoid, OCPD… It is my suspicion increasingly that hoarding may be compounded, or a susceptibility may be present due to f…[Read more]

    • In regards to the self-medicating yes, but the hoarding is not the self-medication, an acquiring addiction is. Hoarding disorder is a completely separate issue as excessive acquiring occurs outside of those with hoarding disorder in addition to frequently co-occuring with hoarding disorder. This self-medicating through acquiring is typically…[Read more]

      • This interface is killing me Marnie… I just typed a really long reply and it vanished. i’m Going to send you and email instead

      • I also see the fortress-effect of the hoard functioning as a huge LEAVE ME ALONE, KEEP OUT OR ELSE, just like substance abuse, and the fortress keeps people/experience from causing pain, it has a distancing, numbing , anesthetic effect. Given the rampant alcoholism in my mother’s family, and her vehement determination that she would never be a…[Read more]

      • I get what you are saying about PD. The problem is basically that 100% of our parents never seek treatment for hoarding disorder so these two populations do not overlap. We don’t know the population in treatment and experts don’t know ours… I don’t know anyone from COH Yahoo whose parent was ever treated and Many seem to feel their paren…[Read more]

        • This was a lot to take in so I hope that I have addressed each issue for you here.

          The ‘fortress effect’ is definitely a common thread in hoarding. Remember that the clutter is a symptom of hoarding disorder, it is a ‘soothing behavior’ for lack of a better description. This explains why there are physical walls built to reflect the internal…[Read more]

          • Have you read Barbara Allen and Jesse Scholl?

            I don’t imagine researchers are oblivious to what they cannot study, only emphasizing that this lacunae is significant issue for many COH whom I talk to… it is a major road block for many who feel that experts “don’t get it.” Many have disengaged… but the landscape is very different from what wa…[Read more]

          • I would agree that the landscape is significantly different now. Additionally, more and more COH and spouses are getting out in the public arena to speak about their experience and the impact on their lives as well as partnering with researchers. These include, but are not limited to, the authors you mentioned, Cecelia Garrett – who has partnered…[Read more]

          • 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻🙂

          • Group in 30 minutes, will you be participating? Amelia is likely unable to, she’s out of town doing some self-care.

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 2 weeks, 4 days ago

    I would be more comfortable with “forced intervention does not work” and leave aside the distracting red herring of “self-determination “

    The other issue is that “legal competency” standard turns a blind eye to a zillion shades of diminished capacity.

    I also don’t feel like APS tries to connect her to services or options. Their approach is “…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 2 weeks, 5 days ago

    This sort of thing definitely satisfies my curiosity about how they understand themselves… ultimately, I think I have fierce substantive conflict regarding the meaning of self-determination, as a political philosopher there is no self-determination or autonomy without reason and rational self interest. Being a prisoner to irrational desire,…[Read more]

    • I hear what you are saying. The other issue that has an impact in regards to APS, especially in hoarding cases, is knowledge, understanding, and resources. We are working on that but it’s a long process.

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 2 weeks, 6 days ago

    Marnie, that is perfect, extremely helpful, thank you very much. exactly what i needed to feel confident that i am approaching this objectively, and not as “coh”

    This suffices to help me decide how to act (or not)

    On the reflective side… regarding what she “wants” surely we cannot dismiss her explicitly expressed wishes…. but I still…[Read more]

    • Glad you find this helpful. In working collaboratively for years with APS, capacity, especially in hoarding is not always well defined. The basic threshold is, is the person able to understand the consequences of their behavior. Before going further into this, read through this:…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 2 weeks, 6 days ago

    I don’t know how to remove myself from this equation apart from doing nothing, but I have no confidence that is the “right” call for *her* bc I am involved and interested, and I am the only other party concerned with her welfare…
    I feel it is an impossible catch-22

    • It can definitely be a catch-22. That being said, being the ‘only party concerned with her welfare’ seems to apply to her lack of concern for her own welfare too. This puts us back to the previous question of who wants it more. This is likely a piece that APS has taken into consideration too. If the person doesn’t want the help they are offering,…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 2 weeks, 6 days ago

    Thank you Marnie, it is very helpful to hear that from someone who has to make same decision in professional context… can you tell me what criteria you use to decide in your work when it is time to stop? Certainly i know that coh wanting to do the right thing is great cover for very complex desires, and yet I’m not happy with ‘my best,” and…[Read more]

    • My decision to stopping work is based on the answer to the following question
      Based on the current level of engagement, who wants this effort more, me or the client? If I find myself pushing or on the verge of arguing with a client, this is a red flag. There is a difference between challenging the person to assess/change thoughts and behaviors and…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 2 weeks, 6 days ago

    Marnie, did you see fb post that APS closed case … #$%@#$# 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🙂
    Haven’t decided what to do, if anything… likely waiting re: bank deadline june 4… maybe follow up with lawyer … maybe just keep sending drinking water… I cannot stand the thought that when something happens to her they will say they did everything they could……

    • It’s difficult to understand the limitations set on APS and most state agencies in regards to that infamous and often contentious term “self-determination”. Limited ‘reach’ and resources often govern the ability to force change. I am sorry that you are having to go through this. Your inclination of just providing her with drinking water may indeed…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 3 weeks ago

    The other thing i might add is that while I understand you worry about their feelings bc that is how you were trained, parentified etc, that’s not your responsibility. You are accountable for your feelings and the sooner you reverse those priorities the better. That said, facing your own feelings ultimately has little to do with what or how you…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 3 weeks ago

    I wish my mother had more time… but it is encouraging to know of progress… still amazing how backwards it all seems…

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 3 weeks ago

    Ultimately my biggest challenge is letting go… I’m a fixer, just about all of this could be fixed, if she’d let me… accepting her living in her car, etc., when I could have and still could fix many of the most egregious problems regarding her physical safety is VERY hard to accept. It makes me angry, frustrated that she subjects me and…[Read more]

    • You are in a really frustrating situation to put it very lightly. There is a point in situations where I have to consider if I am being helpful anymore to person or the situation. While all the actions of a team to help someone resolve a hoarding situation are clearly going to be helpful, if the person is refusing and/or stuck and unable to…[Read more]

  • Claudia Schaler posted a new activity comment 3 weeks ago

    That is interesting… I knew my mother was impossible whenI was 2 bc she spent my 2nd birthday ignoring me and obsessing over my bday cake. i was told it is unusual to have such early memories, but I also remember my potty chair and lots of stuff from then, our cat, etc …I have consistent memories from nursery school but more episodic from…[Read more]

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